funked posted 02-24-99 12:29 PM ET (US)        

I've noticed these planes on some WB "wish" lists. My understanding is that the F was basically an A with outer cannon removed, and conversion kits for stores carriage. And the G was an extended-range F.

My question is what ordnance was commonly carried by F and G? Does this ordnance differ significantly from what our current A models can carry in WB? Furthermore could all F and G ordnance be carried by A's with proper conversion kits?

Most of the Allied fighter types are allowed to carry all of the dual-role ordnance that was used historically. Maybe we don't need an F or G, just a wider selection of the ordnance actually carried on A's.

funked posted 02-24-99 12:37 PM ET (US)            

This is what made me think of the first question.

When I was a kid, I built a Monogram 1/48-scale radial-engined Fw 190 that came with a large assortment of rockets, bombs, and underwing gun pods of 30mm calibre. I don't remember what build it represented (A, F, G).

I, of course, built it with every possible weapon mounted. It protected my bedroom from intruders quite well before an unfortunate demise in testing of a solid-fuel rocket propulsion system, A.K.A. bottle rockets.

What, if any, version of the Fw 190 carried all this stuff at once?

delta posted 02-24-99 03:11 PM ET (US)            

Sorry I can't answer your 190 question, but ...

Could we have more details on the solid - rocket propulsion system tests?

Just what exactly were you up to? I used blacks cats myself to conduct structural damage testing.

Inquiring minds want to know!!!

delta

Bino posted 02-24-99 04:58 PM ET (US)            

Ask Doc Doom. Last time we got into a discussion here on AGW about the various armament options on the 190, he was able to cite chapter and verse.

This is all I can find right now on the i-net: both the F and G variants omitted the outboard 20mm cannons and retained the wing root 20mm cannons. They could carry five bombs: on one centerline (250 Kg ?) bomb rack and four under-wing (50 Kg ?) bomb racks. In the cowl, the F version had a pair of 7.9mm guns, the G a pair of 13mm guns. I can't find anything about the air-to-ground rockets. And I assume the usual FW-190 Rustsatze kits (MK108 pods, etc.) used on the A versions would be available in the field for F and G.

bino-- <II./JG54> bino.warbirds.org

Windle posted 02-24-99 05:02 PM ET (US)            

I believe that the G model was a long range fighter bomber whose only weaponry was two 20mm's in the wing roots. It had hardpoints under the wings for a 75 gallon drop tank or 110 lb bombs and a fuselage rack for carrying 500lb and 2205lb bombs or even a 3980 pounder! Bad news is in order to carry the 'big' bomb all of the other armament including all guns were stripped from the plane and it took over a mile to get it off the ground. Some G models were fitted with the MW 50 fuel injection system as well as nitrous oxide injection.

The F model also had the wing hard points (four) and a centerline bomb rack. Its primary armament was upgraded replacing the 7.9mm cowl-mounted guns with 13mm guns to better complement the 20mm's in the wings. Also the F-8 models could carry up to a 3,086 lb torpedo and some were outfitted with 88mm 'projectile launching tubes' for tank busting.

-Windle-

8X VF-17 'The Jolly Rogers' 8X

funked posted 02-24-99 05:32 PM ET (US)            

Thanks,

The 88mm tubes sound like what I had on the model. Sounds like fun if we get some vehicles to shoot at.

The extra bombs would be very welcome right now. The 50kg eggs are great for ack busting, four of them would be a nice complement to a 500kg on the centerline.

Delta: The rocket propulsion testing was what happened to models that weren't cosmetically perfect. Eventually a newer model would be built that didn't have glue on the canopy, fingerprints on the paint job, etc. At this time the older models were generally "retired" in a fiery manner.

bod posted 02-24-99 05:38 PM ET (US)            

There where myriads of different variants of all the 190 models (U's and R's and independent removal of cannons, guns and bomb-racks).

Basically the A3 was the first version using "factory conversion" or Umruest-Bausaetze, therefore the U designation, (U1 U3 and U4). A3 was a pure fighter, U1 and U3 were FB (U1 had guns removed and 500 kg bomb while U3 had full armament and 250 kg bomb, some with 50 kg bombs in addition. Armament was often removed) while the U4 was a reconnaisance fighter. Since they all were factory conversions they could not be modified in the field.

The A4 only had U1 U3 and U8 (as i know of) but there were also a field conversion, the R6. The R6 had a pair of 210mm rockets to break up allied bomber groups (would be really cool to have in WB). The U8 (similar to A3-U3, did however have very varied armament and bomb racks). A4-U8 must be a cool plane in other words.

The A5 were build in 12 different versions based on the success of the A3/A4 (fighter, jabo, rec ...). Many of these versions were only built in small quantities, as small as only single prototypes. But They were all U conversions not R as far as i know.

The F-1 was basically a modifyed A4 very similar to the A4-U3. The F-2 used the A-5 airframe but was nearly identical to the F-1. It seems that they had 2x250kg bombs under the wings and a 500kg bomb in center.

The f-3 (A-6 airframe) had either one 250 kg bomb and 4? 50 kg bombs (R1) or 2 30 mm MK 103 kannons instead of the ETC 50 bomb racks (R3). (seems strange that it had much less bombs than the F-1/F-2, maybe due to increased armor ?)

The F-8 - F10 used the A-8 airframe and similar weapon as the F-3 /R1. (in addition to the 13mm instead of the 7.9 mm in thge nose)

The most common was the F-3/R3 with 30 mm cannons i think ??

Strange, it seems that the A3-A5 with its vareous factory conversions and independant removal/addition of racks/guns was nearly just as well armed as a FB as the F series. The F series did however have larger canopy, stronger undercarriage and much improved bomb-releesing systems making it a better FB overall (Much better armored as well?).

Also a lot of small quantity F models with torpedoes, missiles (fireing backwards) etc were made.

Bod TWV

funked posted 02-24-99 06:04 PM ET (US)            

Doh I answered my own question!

Check this out:

www.csd.uwo.ca/~pettypi/elevon/baugher_other/fw190.html#RTFToC13

Apparently the MK 103 were not used in service. But check out the Fw 190F-8/U1 - 1x500kg + 2x250kg bombs.

Other than the stores stations it appears to be identical to an A-8 but without MW 50 (which WB doesn't model anyways), and minus the outboard cannons.

It also looks like there were a variety air-ground rockets available from 1944 onward.