Posted by: Strider 417

Message:

Well, for almost a full year now (my whole WB career, actually), I've been a dedicated spit pilot. This is partly due to history (I'm canadian), squad reasons (RCAF, although we tend to fly a nice variety), and partly due to the fact that its just a great, classic a/c and sweet to fly.

*BUT*, on a warbirds binge this week I decided to buck the trend and try something new. I took a p51 up from rear fields only and flew offensive missions. Base busting, BnZ, you know, flights where you generally start with an advantage. I flew about 35 of my 50 or so flights since the score was reset in a 51 and I'm posting my best score ever (a very middling 1 kill per flight, with 15 or so landed out of 50 or so plus a 7 kill streak)... nothing great I know, but good for me:)

Its a great airplane and I think I'm a convert. Question is: what the heck do you set the conv at? I have about 50 assists, or one per kill almost! Is this normal for a p51? Perhaps I'm used to the 1-burst kill potential the spit has and have to learn to dose the targets with more, but...

Anyway, whats the best convergence setting? I've been using 216.

Any other thoughts on the best employment of the 51 are most welcome:)

Strider 417

ps: from now on, I think I can get through any tour flying Merlin powered planes only:

The hurri for 1940

spit 5 and 9 for defensive or interception (tactical) missions

P51 for offensive missions

Mossie for base-busting:)

MERLIN POWER!

Posted by: cmos

Posted on: 13:54:46 11/03/98

Posted from:

Subject: good comments -- more below

In Reply to: Re: p51 questions

Posted by: -bmbm-, CO RSAF on 11:16:01 11/03/98

Message: :

: : Its a great airplane and I think I'm a convert. Question is: what the heck do you set the conv at? I have about 50 assists, or one per kill almost! Is this normal for a p51?

: Pretty normal for a first-time stang jock, yes, IMO. I started out averaging 4 assists for every kill :-D

>>yup I agree. For newbies, I would characterize the pony as "easy to fly, hard to be effective in". but worth the effort.

: : Anyway, whats the best convergence setting? I've been using 216.

Typo? Why the odd number?

: I have my convergence at 200. I usually start firing at 250-300 yards, miss some, correct, and inflict maximum damage at 200. This is also the typical distance I fire at when the bandit goes vertical, or in high-deflection shots. This is drawn from experience rather than wishful thinking, and remain much the same regardless of which kite I fly. With gunnery around 20%, I still have a long way to go

>> Yah. I usually run 200 convergence, I have bumped it up to 225 recently. For whatever reason, my gunnery has improved a tad in 2.5, and I increased conv. slightly to get a little longer 'kill zone'. If you're using the P51 right, you will have significant closure on your bogy, and your burst, starting at ~300, will move through the convergence zone as you close. I try to compromise between a longer convergence zone and not being able to hit at a longer range.

: : Any other thoughts on the best employment of the 51 are most welcome:)

: Escort, is without a doubt its forte. It does pretty well all around if you stay disciplined :-)

>> Disciplined says it all. Flown within its boundaries, the pony can kill effectively against just about anything, although some late war iron will give it problems. I'd say 75 % of my deaths are from violating my hard deck and getting caught low and slow. The rest of them come from not disengaging -- or disengaging too late -- against superior numbers.

But here I am talking like I actually know something about the pony and am good in it. Eman or someone should speak up.

cmos

Posted by: Eman =4th FG=

Message:

There is really not a whole lot I can add to all the good feedback that has been presented so far.

I was using 250 conv before I found out that the real 4th used it so I was quite happy when I found out, but as several have said it is personal preference and no definitive right or wrong answer.

Most folks know that the 51D is my all out favorite WWII fighter and I have flown it almost exclusively for over 2 years. It does take considerable discipline to do well in it. I remember when I first stated flying it I was pretty scared about engaging in any fights because of my inability to turn well in it. I had to switch from the turn, burn and die mentality to one of learning how to judge my opponents speed, alt, type of aicraft and countless other things that go into having a successful sortie. One thing that is crucial IMO is knowing at what point you are losing the fight and exiting before it is too late.

Most of the time I try and fly to survive much like a real pilot would but how anyone plays the game is their business and no one elses.

I feel the my strongest skills are Situational Awareness and gunnery with ACM being in the mediocre range. Very often when closing for what will hopefully be a kill I will check ALL my others views for incoming enemies.

I realize a lot of my comments are not specific to the 51 and are good ones to practice no matter what you fly.

On the gunnery side of things I too have seen a slight improvement in my percentage which held around 18-19 in 2.01 and is currently at 22. It may be that the higher rate of fire has something to do with this. My ratio of assists to kills is about 25% but it took me a long time to get to that point.

There are very few shortcuts in this game and a very steep learning curve.

Eman

Posted by: No.6 (-bcnu-) CO Fourth Fighter Group

Message:

The Fourth used 250 yards convergence during the war. If it's good enough for the best, it's good enough for me :)

Posted by: Jokr

Message: : The Fourth used 250 yards convergence during the war. If it's good enough for the best, it's good enough for me :)

Boss, I found that if I hold fire until less than 3, I usually run into the darn enemy plane. SO, I use usually 400 for the 51 and 500 for the 47.

Gun accuracy is around 14%, and my kills range from 0 to 5 on sorties... I'm fairly unpredictable.

In the f6f (which I use for base defense sometimes) I keep it at 300; that busts stuff up nicely.

Am I abnormal here, or what?

(obvious flames / toastings / snickers at that comment will be kept for future in squad fight motivation) ;)

Jokr

Posted by: dadi 4th FG

Message:

Jokr, I use 200 conv in stang. I fire at d2. I will fire at d3 or d4 if deflect shot or con going vert. As far as crashing, try improving your throt control. In my opinion, throt control is the most overlooked aspect of wbs. At least it was for me. Now with the decimals for distance, it is now even easier to get at d2 safely.

hope it helps

dadi 4th FG

ps, my gunnery prior to wb2.5 usually held between 18-20%...

mostly luck tho:)

Posted by: -ford-

Message:

I read a story from a p-51 pilot the other day and I remember him saying that he had 2 convergence settings. I thought he said the outter and inner guns, but it could have been first set and second set. Anyway I think he said the inner guns were set at around 250 and the outter guns were set at about 300. I could look it up and get you the authors name and exact quote if you want.

-ford-

Posted by: -sick- [CO/487th FS]

Message:

> Wanted to know what the best used. :)

the 352nd FG used staggered conversion. the inner pair of guns converged at 200 yards, the middle pair at 250 yards, and the outer pair at 300 yards. this gave a cone effect of deadly fire. unfortunately, you cant do that in WB, so i use a stock 300 yard convergence. the key is a convergence that is near your optimum, and half your maximum. 600 yards is a pretty reasonable maximum, and while you can debate whether 200, 250 or 300 is the best optimum, i know i wouldn't want the dispersion at longer ranges that 200 gives (or even 250, personally). however, this is very much a personal preference issue, hehehe.

sick

Posted by: -Rush-

Message: I like mine at 450, I open up at D5, and keep firing till I hit D2, if you do it right, the hits start out at the center and spread till your almost at the middle of each wing. Even if you don't kill them you usually do enough damage to finish em off in the next pass. Of course you have to be a good shot, and a large monitor helps : ) But I like it in a BnZ AC, in a TnB I set mine at 225.

Posted by: -fluf- 417 RCAF

Message: Hi Stridr!

There was a great website a few years ago that had pictures and diagrams of P51 equipment etc. Included were the gun harmonization gigs used to set convergence. The 2 convergence ranges available were 250 yards and 300 yards. I use 250 or 270. The P51 is the best all round fighter in WB IMO.

-fluf-